Latest topics
» No Objection Letter
Sat Dec 16, 2017 5:21 pm by zeph03

» CATERING SERVICES FOR CONGRESSIONAL MEET AT SAGBAYAN, BOHOL
Thu Dec 14, 2017 7:14 pm by btorres4

» PURCHASE OF FERTILIZERS FOR LIVESTOCK, CORN, HVCDP, INLAND FISHERY, AND ORGANIC PROGRAM
Thu Dec 14, 2017 4:35 pm by btorres4

» Newspaper Publication
Thu Dec 14, 2017 4:10 pm by btorres4

» RENTAL OF LIGHTS AND SOUND SYSTEM
Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:46 pm by btorres4

» Newspaper Publication
Wed Dec 13, 2017 9:50 pm by btorres4

» PURCHASE OF OTHER SUPPLIES FOR SB OFFICE
Wed Dec 13, 2017 4:51 pm by btorres4

» PURCHASE OF RICE FOR FOOD SUPPLIES OF PEACE & ORDER CAMPAIGN
Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:19 pm by btorres4

» Expired Tax Clearance during payment
Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:11 pm by vallemaco6224

» PURCHASE OF MEDICINE FOR MHO
Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:53 pm by btorres4


Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by venom.0420 on Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:41 pm

Under RA 9184 the BAC must at least have 5 members and maximum of 7 members. Of the five, 3 must be regular members and 2 will be provisional members. The 2 provisional members will be the Technical Representative and a representative of the end-user unit.

My query is in line with the payment of honoraria to the representative of the end-user unit. Is there such a limitation as to the number of representative a particular end-user unit may appoint? If there is none, I guess indirectly the 25% cap is defeated, because once a particular representative from the end-user unit reaches it's limit, the end-user unit may simply appoint another one who can benefit from such privilege. It doesn't pose much problem if there is sufficient funding to pay such claims, yet, will result to the disadvantage of the other four members if funding is not enough. Sad
avatar
venom.0420
Active Poster
Active Poster

Male Number of posts : 98
Company/Agency : Government
Occupation/Designation : Government Employee
Registration date : 2009-01-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:47 am

venom.0420 wrote:Under RA 9184 the BAC must at least have 5 members and maximum of 7 members. Of the five, 3 must be regular members and 2 will be provisional members. The 2 provisional members will be the Technical Representative and a representative of the end-user unit.

My query is in line with the payment of honoraria to the representative of the end-user unit. Is there such a limitation as to the number of representative a particular end-user unit may appoint? If there is none, I guess indirectly the 25% cap is defeated, because once a particular representative from the end-user unit reaches it's limit, the end-user unit may simply appoint another one who can benefit from such privilege. It doesn't pose much problem if there is sufficient funding to pay such claims, yet, will result to the disadvantage of the other four members if funding is not enough. Sad

The purpose of the end-user representative is to ensure that the end-user of the project being procured is well represented in the BAC. Each end-user can recommend to the HOPE who will be its representative to the BAC, but it is the HOPE who designates or appoints the representative of each of the end users. Therefore, the end-user cannot "simply appoint another one" if the particualr end-user representative has already reaches the limit of his honoraria.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by engrjhez® on Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:54 am

venom.0420 wrote:Under RA 9184 the BAC must at least have 5 members and maximum of 7 members. Of the five, 3 must be regular members and 2 will be provisional members. The 2 provisional members will be the Technical Representative and a representative of the end-user unit...
And since we know that BAC (including it's end user member) must have been appointed prior to their assumption of duties and responsibilities, all other appointees (maybe you are referring to substitutes in case of absence[?]) cannot be granted honiraria unless they have been appointed for such; And in no case members shall exceed the maximum... in favor of anyone Very Happy
avatar
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2481
Age : 39
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : Office of the City Legal Service (OCLS) / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by venom.0420 on Tue Mar 31, 2009 2:47 pm

To sir RDV and Engrjhez:

Does it mean that there is a problem with our appointment 'coz it only identified the BAC Chairman, Vice-Chairman, Finance Rep, Legal Rep and Technical Rep. and did not identify the end-user in particular?
avatar
venom.0420
Active Poster
Active Poster

Male Number of posts : 98
Company/Agency : Government
Occupation/Designation : Government Employee
Registration date : 2009-01-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Tue Mar 31, 2009 3:11 pm

venom.0420 wrote:To sir RDV and Engrjhez:

Does it mean that there is a problem with our appointment 'coz it only identified the BAC Chairman, Vice-Chairman, Finance Rep, Legal Rep and Technical Rep. and did not identify the end-user in particular?

Another appointment for the provisional member will solve the problem. Since the law requires that the end-user should always be represented, it is desirable that end-user representatives should be identified before hand and properly designated as provisional members for projects in which their offices are the end-users. Once a project is up for bid, the end-user representative automatically becomes the provisional member in the BAC for that project. Otherwise, the end-user representative can be designated at the time the project is up for bid. No problem with that.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by engrjhez® on Tue Mar 31, 2009 5:12 pm

venom.0420 wrote:To sir RDV and Engrjhez:

Does it mean that there is a problem with our appointment 'coz it only identified the BAC Chairman, Vice-Chairman, Finance Rep, Legal Rep and Technical Rep. and did not identify the end-user in particular?
What I think is haunting you is the representation of end user themselves. In an LGU, there's actually more department and units that could fit in the maximum number of members allowed for the BAC composition. It follows that, if it's a must that end users are always represented, where can they all be accomodated?

Is it your question?

In our case, one move in harmonizing to the GPRA is to have all regular office supplies and general outlays be centralized in the GSO. Most of the time, especially when office supplies are to be procured, the Head of GSO, a BAC Member, represents most of the end-users in our agency. Engineering and other technical and legal aspects shall be reprented by another BAC member, and so on. The rest is coordination.

Going back, it is also possible that your question looks like this:
Can we have more than 7 BAC member appointees (to accommodate each particular end user) but only the maximum allowed number (7) of members seat a particular bidding? The excess shall be attending in "rotation-basis" as provisional members when and where procurements concerned their office(s)?

Very Happy Help is needed here... Very Happy
avatar
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2481
Age : 39
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : Office of the City Legal Service (OCLS) / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Tue Mar 31, 2009 6:13 pm

engrjhez wrote:
What I think is haunting you is the representation of end user themselves. In an LGU, there's actually more department and units that could fit in the maximum number of members allowed for the BAC composition. It follows that, if it's a must that end users are always represented, where can they all be accomodated?

Going back, it is also possible that your question looks like this:
Can we have more than 7 BAC member appointees (to accommodate each particular end user) but only the maximum allowed number (7) of members seat a particular bidding? The excess shall be attending in "rotation-basis" as provisional members when and where procurements concerned their office(s)?

Very Happy Help is needed here... Very Happy [/color]

I don't know where is the confusion. Definitely, all the departments and units, thru their end-user representatives, could not fit into the BAC considering that there is a limitation of up to seven members only.

The end-user representative is a provisional member of the BAC, as such he/she will only serve as BAC member for the time being where his/her department or unit is the end user. In other words, provisional members are ad hoc and shall serve only per procurement basis. But a particular department or unit can have a permanent representative, depending on the procuring entity.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by engrjhez® on Wed Apr 01, 2009 8:57 pm

RDV wrote:I don't know where is the confusion. Definitely, all the departments and units, thru their end-user representatives, could not fit into the BAC considering that there is a limitation of up to seven members only.

The end-user representative is a provisional member of the BAC, as such he/she will only serve as BAC member for the time being where his/her department or unit is the end user. In other words, provisional members are ad hoc and shall serve only per procurement basis. But a particular department or unit can have a permanent representative, depending on the procuring entity.
This (what I think) is venom's concern. While the regular members sit on all procurements, the adhocs enjoy less task with the same honoraria (especially when the number of biddings exceed their 25% average rates). Say, we have 10 end user representatives that will act as the provisional (end-user) member. Suppose there is such bidding that is so diverse that all the said 10 people will have to be represented, how do we resolve the maximum limits?

Another issue confronted here is: let us say the average 25% cap is reached every average of 3 biddings (monthly basis). An end user BAC member may enjoy this limit as long as an average of three (3) procurements per month is attained. This will also mean, that if there are ten (10) end-user BAC members who happened to enjoy the same, then there must be an average of thiry (30) procurements per month (this is just an exaggeration for discussion purposes only). While the end-user BAC members participated just 3 (on the average), the regular BAC members sat exhaustively on all 10.
avatar
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2481
Age : 39
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : Office of the City Legal Service (OCLS) / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:41 am

engrjhez wrote:This (what I think) is venom's concern. While the regular members sit on all procurements, the adhocs enjoy less task with the same honoraria (especially when the number of biddings exceed their 25% average rates). Say, we have 10 end user representatives that will act as the provisional (end-user) member. Suppose there is such bidding that is so diverse that all the said 10 people will have to be represented, how do we resolve the maximum limits?

The maximum limit of BAC membership has been set in IRR-A at seven (7) and, since it is not possible that all the 10 end-user can be represented, the procuring entity has to decide who can be the end-user representive from among them. The choice is now up to the procuring entity, maybe on the basis on which has the most interest on the project. For example, the GSO may be designated as end-user representative on such cases as very diverse procurement. Additional provisional member of 2 may be designated also, instead of just one, for every procurement, within the limit of total BAC membership of seven (7).

engrjhez wrote:Another issue confronted here is: let us say the average 25% cap is reached every average of 3 biddings (monthly basis). An end user BAC member may enjoy this limit as long as an average of three (3) procurements per month is attained. This will also mean, that if there are ten (10) end-user BAC members who happened to enjoy the same, then there must be an average of thiry (30) procurements per month (this is just an exaggeration for discussion purposes only). While the end-user BAC members participated just 3 (on the average), the regular BAC members sat exhaustively on all 10. [/color][/justify]
Based on my answer to the first question, this exaggerated scenario, therefore, is not likely to happen.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by engrjhez® on Fri Apr 03, 2009 6:41 pm

RDV wrote:The maximum limit of BAC membership has been set in IRR-A at seven (7) and, since it is not possible that all the 10 end-user can be represented, the procuring entity has to decide who can be the end-user representive from among them. The choice is now up to the procuring entity, maybe on the basis on which has the most interest on the project. For example, the GSO may be designated as end-user representative on such cases as very diverse procurement. Additional provisional member of 2 may be designated also, instead of just one, for every procurement, within the limit of total BAC membership of seven (7).
This I think resolves the issue. Please confirm this further, for everyone's benefit of understanding the IRR. The end-user representative is not to be taken literally. Meaning, even if we actually have 10 or more departments in an LGU, only one shall be chosen to represent them all.


avatar
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2481
Age : 39
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : Office of the City Legal Service (OCLS) / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:17 pm

engrjhez wrote:
RDV wrote:The maximum limit of BAC membership has been set in IRR-A at seven (7) and, since it is not possible that all the 10 end-user can be represented, the procuring entity has to decide who can be the end-user representive from among them. The choice is now up to the procuring entity, maybe on the basis on which has the most interest on the project. For example, the GSO may be designated as end-user representative on such cases as very diverse procurement. Additional provisional member of 2 may be designated also, instead of just one, for every procurement, within the limit of total BAC membership of seven (7).
This I think resolves the issue. Please confirm this further, for everyone's benefit of understanding the IRR. The end-user representative is not to be taken literally. Meaning, even if we actually have 10 or more departments in an LGU, only one shall be chosen to represent them all.
To clarify further, I will just cite example. For example, the BAC decided to lump several procurement projects, covered by several PPMPs like procurement of computer units, into one. Considering that there could be several end-users, let us say 10 departments as engrjhez has cited, naturally, all of them cannot be provisional members as the maximum 7 BAC members will be exceedeed. So, only 1 or 2 could probably be designated as provisional member(s), who will be entitled to vote, sign BAC resolutions, and to Honoraria (if he/she does not come from the procurement unit of the agency). What about the others? They can be part of the pre-procurement conference. They can be unofficial observers during the bidding process, if they want to, but they cannot alternate with one another in the procurement process, like one seats during the pre-bid, another during the opening, another during the evaluation, another during the post-qual., and another during award. Imagine, the confusion it would cause.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by engrjhez® on Sat Apr 04, 2009 3:20 pm

RDV wrote:
To clarify further, I will just cite example. For example, the BAC decided to lump several procurement projects, covered by several PPMPs like procurement of computer units, into one. Considering that there could be several end-users, let us say 10 departments as engrjhez has cited, naturally, all of them cannot be provisional members as the maximum 7 BAC members will be exceedeed. So, only 1 or 2 could probably be designated as provisional member(s), who will be entitled to vote, sign BAC resolutions,...
... for their (one-year) fixed term, and such designation shall be made with the creation of BAC and shall in no case be replaced by anyone from the group (who was/were not appointed for the purpose).
RDV wrote:... and to Honoraria (if he/she does not come from the procurement unit of the agency).
Someone may ask, "Does this mean Head of the GSO acting as BAC member cannot be entitled to honoraria?"
RDV wrote:What about the others? They can be part of the pre-procurement conference. They can be unofficial observers during the bidding process, if they want to, but they cannot alternate with one another in the procurement process, like one seats during the pre-bid, another during the opening, another during the evaluation, another during the post-qual., and another during award. Imagine, the confusion it would cause.
To sum it all, end-user(s) shall be appointed in a way to complete the committee of 5-7 BAC members. In no way alternates are allowed in a "waitlist" nor substitute any of them during their term. Very Happy
avatar
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2481
Age : 39
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : Office of the City Legal Service (OCLS) / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Sat Apr 04, 2009 4:15 pm

engrjhez wrote:
RDV wrote:
To clarify further, I will just cite example. For example, the BAC decided to lump several procurement projects, covered by several PPMPs like procurement of computer units, into one. Considering that there could be several end-users, let us say 10 departments as engrjhez has cited, naturally, all of them cannot be provisional members as the maximum 7 BAC members will be exceedeed. So, only 1 or 2 could probably be designated as provisional member(s), who will be entitled to vote, sign BAC resolutions,...
... for their (one-year) fixed term, and such designation shall be made with the creation of BAC and shall in no case be replaced by anyone from the group (who was/were not appointed for the purpose).[color=green]

Who says they have a 1-year fixed term? I don't know if it is my English or what, but I won't lose my patience (this time). End-user representatives are "provisional members". If you look at my previous posts, it means "for the time being", "ad hoc", only in procurements where their units are involved. If their units are not involved, then another provisional member representing that particular unit is designated.
engrjhez wrote:
RDV wrote:... and to Honoraria (if he/she does not come from the procurement unit of the agency).
Someone may ask, "Does this mean Head of the GSO acting as BAC member cannot be entitled to honoraria?"
Why not? He is a BAC member not a BAC Secretariat coming from a Procurement Unit.

engrjhez wrote:
RDV wrote:What about the others? They can be part of the pre-procurement conference. They can be unofficial observers during the bidding process, if they want to, but they cannot alternate with one another in the procurement process, like one seats during the pre-bid, another during the opening, another during the evaluation, another during the post-qual., and another during award. Imagine, the confusion it would cause.
To sum it all, end-user(s) shall be appointed in a way to complete the committee of 5-7 BAC members. In no way alternates are allowed in a "waitlist" nor substitute any of them during their term. Very Happy
Same answer as in the first.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by engrjhez® on Sat Apr 04, 2009 5:12 pm

RDV wrote:Who says they have a 1-year fixed term? ...
If end-user representatives are appointed as BAC members, then will these sections apply?

  • 11.2.3. The members to be designated by the head of the procuring entity to the BAC shall be at least five (5), but not more than seven (7).

  • 11.2.4. Unless sooner removed for a cause, the members of the BAC shall have a fixed term of one (1) year reckoned from the date of appointment, renewable at the discretion of the head of the procuring entity. In case of resignation, retirement, separation, transfer, re-assignment, removal, death, the replacement shall serve only for the unexpired term: Provided, however, That in case of leave or suspension, the replacement shall serve only for the duration of the leave or suspension. For justifiable causes, a member shall be suspended or removed by the head of the procuring entity. In the interest of professionalization, the head of the procuring entity is encouraged to extend the terms of office of deserving members.

Patience... and Peace!
study
avatar
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2481
Age : 39
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : Office of the City Legal Service (OCLS) / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Sun Apr 05, 2009 12:58 pm

engrjhez wrote:
RDV wrote:Who says they have a 1-year fixed term? ...
If end-user representatives are appointed as BAC members, then will these sections apply?

  • 11.2.3. The members to be designated by the head of the procuring entity to the BAC shall be at least five (5), but not more than seven (7).

  • 11.2.4. Unless sooner removed for a cause, the members of the BAC shall have a fixed term of one (1) year reckoned from the date of appointment, renewable at the discretion of the head of the procuring entity. In case of resignation, retirement, separation, transfer, re-assignment, removal, death, the replacement shall serve only for the unexpired term: Provided, however, That in case of leave or suspension, the replacement shall serve only for the duration of the leave or suspension. For justifiable causes, a member shall be suspended or removed by the head of the procuring entity. In the interest of professionalization, the head of the procuring entity is encouraged to extend the terms of office of deserving members.

Patience... and Peace!
study

Although, I am not a lawyer, one of the basic principle of Statutory Construction is that statutes must be read and construed as a whole. Sec. 11.2.4 would basically apply to regular members and not to provisional members.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by venom.0420 on Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:39 pm

engrjhez wrote:

This (what I think) is venom's concern. While the regular members sit on all procurements, the adhocs enjoy less task with the same honoraria (especially when the number of biddings exceed their 25% average rates). Say, we have 10 end user representatives that will act as the provisional (end-user) member. Suppose there is such bidding that is so diverse that all the said 10 people will have to be represented, how do we resolve the maximum limits?

Another issue confronted here is: let us say the average 25% cap is reached every average of 3 biddings (monthly basis). An end user BAC member may enjoy this limit as long as an average of three (3) procurements per month is attained. This will also mean, that if there are ten (10) end-user BAC members who happened to enjoy the same, then there must be an average of thiry (30) procurements per month (this is just an exaggeration for discussion purposes only). While the end-user BAC members participated just 3 (on the average), the regular BAC members sat exhaustively on all 10.

This is exactly what I mean. Thank you sir Engrjhez for elaborating on it. Based on sir RDV's responses, there could only be 7 BAC members at most, which is exactly what RA 9184 states. However, it also states that the provisional members are (a) An officer who has technical expertise (b) A representative from the end user unit. While the former can be named in the Office Order, the latter will remain anonymous until a particular project is subjected to bidding. Hence, the scenario that sir Engrjhez mentioned above is not totally an exaggeration but a case which is likely to happen in any procuring entity.

Further, RA 9184 stated it explicitly so it can be taken literally. So until, the GPPB makes a resolution clarifying this issue, it will be taken how it was written.

Btw, I'm sorry for replying just now. I was on vacation for several days and intentionally left my laptop at home to avoid working on my vacation. You should try it sometime. Very Happy
avatar
venom.0420
Active Poster
Active Poster

Male Number of posts : 98
Company/Agency : Government
Occupation/Designation : Government Employee
Registration date : 2009-01-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by mbdr on Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:30 am

Sirs gdam,

In relation to this discussion, may I ask kung pwede ba to .......

Lets say, we have the City Admin (BAC Chairman), the Budget Officer, the Treasurer, the Engineer, the Legal Officer and the GS Officer .... for the regular BAC members. For the provisional member/s is /are coming the from the office (operating unit) -the end-user.

The BAC issue a resolution for their monthly honorarium (fixed rate)5000 for the BAC Chairman and 4500 for the regular and provisional members of the BAC . In this case, the regular members will received their monthly fixed rate while the provisional members will have his rate computed as :

- if in a month there are 10 provisional members (take note coming from the different offices as end-users, one end-user per office) whose requisitions are realized (succesful procurement- with PO's), the 4500 rate intended for them ( provisional member) shall be divided equally to them ; 4500 /10-450.00 per end-user ang kanilang honorarium for that month.

Ang hirap e explain sirs... I hope nakuha nyu ang point ko.

mbdr
Active Poster
Active Poster

Female Number of posts : 84
Age : 49
Company/Agency : LGU
Occupation/Designation : Govt. Employee/BAC Secretariat
Registration date : 2009-02-23

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by venom.0420 on Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:01 am

mbdr wrote:Sirs gdam,

In relation to this discussion, may I ask kung pwede ba to .......

The BAC issue a resolution for their monthly honorarium (fixed rate)5000 for the BAC Chairman and 4500 for the regular and provisional members of the BAC . In this case, the regular members will received their monthly fixed rate while the provisional members will have his rate computed as :

- if in a month there are 10 provisional members (take note coming from the different offices as end-users, one end-user per office) whose requisitions are realized (succesful procurement- with PO's), the 4500 rate intended for them ( provisional member) shall be divided equally to them ; 4500 /10-450.00 per end-user ang kanilang honorarium for that month.

I think your BAC were misguided when they issued such resolution. There are guidelines in the payment of honoraria and are stated in DBM Circular Nos. 2004-5 and 2004-5A. Please check this link http://www.gppb.gov.ph/cgi-bin/news/archive_news.asp?news_id=92 or use any search engine tool (google, yahoo, etc.) to look for these DBM circulars.

Hope it helps! Very Happy
avatar
venom.0420
Active Poster
Active Poster

Male Number of posts : 98
Company/Agency : Government
Occupation/Designation : Government Employee
Registration date : 2009-01-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by mbdr on Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:23 am

Thanks Sir venom.

Yes I have already a copy of this DBM Circulars. What I want to emphasize here is yung tungkol sa provisional member.

As I said in my early posts, every lgu has its own needs and concerns. At marami rin kaminglapses dito. But one good thing is we are doing our best to correct it.

Thats why im here trying to get the ideas of other BAC practitioners. I'm happy to have you.... and this forum.

Salamat again sir ha!

mbdr
Active Poster
Active Poster

Female Number of posts : 84
Age : 49
Company/Agency : LGU
Occupation/Designation : Govt. Employee/BAC Secretariat
Registration date : 2009-02-23

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:27 am

mbdr wrote:
The BAC issue a resolution for their monthly honorarium (fixed rate)5000 for the BAC Chairman and 4500 for the regular and provisional members of the BAC . In this case, the regular members will received their monthly fixed rate while the provisional members will have his rate computed as :

- if in a month there are 10 provisional members (take note coming from the different offices as end-users, one end-user per office) whose requisitions are realized (succesful procurement- with PO's), the 4500 rate intended for them ( provisional member) shall be divided equally to them ; 4500 /10-450.00 per end-user ang kanilang honorarium for that month.

Ang hirap e explain sirs... I hope nakuha nyu ang point ko.

First, the HOPE, or his duly authorized official, should be the one to issue the Office Order regarding the payment of the honoraria, guided by the provisions of DBM Budget Circular 2004-5A and 2007-3. It should not be the BAC.

Second, your honoraria should not exceed the allowable rates fixed under the said Circulars, and payment should not be fixed monthly but for every "successfully completed procurement project", subject to the limitation under Sec. 15 of the GRPA that it should not exceed 25% of basic monthly salary. The same rate applies to the provisional members.

Third, by way of an example, if there are 3 successfully completed procurement projects in one month, and each of the 3 projects have different provisional members, the regular BAC members, TWG, and BAC Secretariat shall receive honoraria for the 3 projects (honoraria rate x 3). The provisional members will also received their respective honoraria for only one successfully completed project they are involved in. All of which will be subject to the 25% limitation and to availability of funds. If funds are insufficient to cover their full honoraria, then their honoraria will be proportionately reduced.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by engrjhez® on Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:49 am

mbdr wrote:Sirs gdam,

...The BAC issue a resolution for their monthly honorarium (fixed rate)5000 for the BAC Chairman and 4500 for the regular and provisional members of the BAC . In this case, the regular members will received their monthly fixed rate while the provisional members will have his rate computed as :

- if in a month there are 10 provisional members (take note coming from the different offices as end-users, one end-user per office) whose requisitions are realized (succesful procurement- with PO's), the 4500 rate intended for them ( provisional member) shall be divided equally to them ; 4500 /10-450.00 per end-user ang kanilang honorarium for that month.

Ang hirap e explain sirs... I hope nakuha nyu ang point ko.
There is no problem on that sense for as long as the accumulated honoraria received for the entire year does not exceed the maximum of 25% of the basic (annual) salary. This means that, you may exceed this month's 25% cap, but maybe sooner, or next month, when you do not have any procurement, you regain the balance by the average. But since you mentioned issuing a BAC resolution making it a "fixed" monthly honoraria, the circular is, hence, violated.

Please download a copy of DBM BC 2004-5A here.
avatar
engrjhez®
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 2481
Age : 39
Company/Agency : City Government of Bacoor [Region IV-A, Province of Cavite]
Occupation/Designation : Office of the City Legal Service (OCLS) / Certified National Trainer - PhilGEPS
Registration date : 2008-10-31

http://www.bacoor.gov.ph

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:59 am

CORRECT ka diyan, engrjhez!

Going back to my example, the regular BAC members, TWG, and BAC Secretariat (not coming from procurement unit of the procuring entity, hence, ad hoc) can collect their honoraria for the three (3) successfully completed procurement projects (even if exceeding the monthly limit) provided that their respective average honoraria per month, for a one year period, does not exceed 25% of their respective basic monthly salary.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by venom.0420 on Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:27 pm

Sir MBDR,

Your always welcome. With regards to ur query on provisional members, just like what Sir RDV said in his post and as stated also in the DBM Circular 2004-5a, they are entitled to receive Php 2,500 per procurement project but not to exceed 25% of their monthly basic salary.
avatar
venom.0420
Active Poster
Active Poster

Male Number of posts : 98
Company/Agency : Government
Occupation/Designation : Government Employee
Registration date : 2009-01-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by mbdr on Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:17 pm

GDPM Sir RDV , to all and thanks.

Hirap talaga pag honorarium na ang pinagusapan sir no? Pero andyan ang law na kailangan natin sundin .

One more question sirs.... What is incentive? This is mentioned in the Roles and Duties of the HOPE , "he/she must ensure that the members of the BAC and the TWG shall receive their incentives" (page 27 of 103 of the GPPB Generic Procurement Manuals). Is it referring to the honorarium of the BAC sirs? For clarification only sir.

mbdr
Active Poster
Active Poster

Female Number of posts : 84
Age : 49
Company/Agency : LGU
Occupation/Designation : Govt. Employee/BAC Secretariat
Registration date : 2009-02-23

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by RDV @ GP3i on Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:27 pm

mbdr wrote:GDPM Sir RDV , to all and thanks.

Hirap talaga pag honorarium na ang pinagusapan sir no? Pero andyan ang law na kailangan natin sundin .

One more question sirs.... What is incentive? This is mentioned in the Roles and Duties of the HOPE , "he/she must ensure that the members of the BAC and the TWG shall receive their incentives" (page 27 of 103 of the GPPB Generic Procurement Manuals). Is it referring to the honorarium of the BAC sirs? For clarification only sir.

Right, sometimes we got entangled in different interpretations. Pero kung malinaw na ang batas, ang isang principle sa statutory construction ay "interpret it in its literal meaning."

I think, yung term "incentive" na ginamit sa GPM at sa LGU Procurement Manual, specifically pertains to none other than Honoraria. Although Sec. 15 of GPRA does not make it mandatory, as the term "may" was used and not "shall", nevertheless, if the HOPE authorizes the same, then it is his responsibility that all those entitled to receive, particularly the BAC and TWG, shall receive the same.
avatar
RDV @ GP3i
Grand Master
Grand Master

Male Number of posts : 1611
Company/Agency : DBM-Reg'l Office IV-B
Occupation/Designation : Regional Director/ Procurement Trainer
Registration date : 2008-09-04

http://gppphil.org/

Back to top Go down

Re: Clarification on the grant of Honoraria

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum